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It's really a bad idea

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Achilles
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Achilles asked on 21 Sep 2008, 11:28 PM
Hi
I've been using Telerik's web-controls for years and I am really happy with them (except for FireFox3). Today I just decided to give a try to ASP.NET AJAX controls and setup a control panel as soon as I can...
I had some minor problems like:
  1. Smart Tags won't show properly when I embed the telerik controls in a UserControl  (Ajax 1.0 Web Application in VS2008Pro).
  2. above said, I had to review the docs or just respond to runtime errors to handle the smart tags' job, by HAND. It's really annoying to have to add a RadScriptManager everywhere you need a telerik control...
But, this is the worst problem I had:
When I embed a RadEditor in a usercontrol (NewsNew.ascx) and after lots of jumping around(ScriptManager, StylesheetManager, AjaxManager), I get a badly scrambled junk of icons as toolbars in my browser! It took like 5 hours to solve this problem...
In your previous lovely version of controls, radEditor is an IFrame in runtime and therefore isolated from the host page's css and js. Very clean. but this version uses a table for main layout and therefore css rules may drill down to even "the resize handle"!! (put a radEditor inside a div with its dir set to rtl and see it for yourself, or try to write a general css rule for the whole application to handle ul.li.ul nested tags and wee what happens!)

In our company, we have common templates for our applications and these templates are heavily loaded with css and js. I had to rewrite the css from scratch to overcome this drill-down behavior...
It's rally a bad idea to put something like editor inside a table! The IFrame version worked much better.

I have a question too. The ScriptManager uses WebResource HttpHandlers to download the required js files to client's browser. Doesn't this prevent caching on client-side? (The same question goes to StyleSheetManager and css files' caching)

After all, I should thank for the visual improvements. they're really Fabulous!

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Tervel
Telerik team
answered on 23 Sep 2008, 11:03 AM
Hello Mohammad,

Thank you for the provided feedback. I would like to address the points you make one by one, provide you with additional information on the reasoning of the decisions made. Also, there seem to be mixing of information common for / related to all RadControls for ASP.NET AJAX as if it is related to RadEditor only - which might be a source of confusion for other people who encounter this thread.

When I embed a RadEditor in a usercontrol (NewsNew.ascx) and after lots of jumping around(ScriptManager, StylesheetManager, AjaxManager)
<asp:ScriptManager> is required for all controls based on ASP.NET AJAX. Thus, RadEditor and all other Telerik RadControls for ASP.NET AJAX need the presence of this control which provides script and css registration capabilities, as well as a client-side framework. On the other hand, RadStylesheetManager and RadAjaxManager are not needed by RadEditor, and you clearly did not have to add those to get the editor running. The following help article discusses upgrading from RadEditor Classic to RadEditor for ASP.NET AJAX.
http://www.telerik.com/help/aspnet-ajax/editor_migrationfromradeditorclassictoradeditorprometheus.html

"I get a badly scrambled junk of icons as toolbars in my browser! It took like 5 hours to solve this problem..."
The RadEditor for ASP.NET AJAX uses semantic rendering and its tools are implemented as <LI> elements whose tool icon is displayed using CSS. This is common for all RadControls for ASP.NET AJAX. The chosen implementation was the single most important reason why loading time on the client-side has been reduced to one fourth (by 75%) of the time it takes for RadEditor Classic to initialize. While we have done our best to override many commonly used CSS properties (such as padding and margin), sometimes when the editor is added to a page with lots of global CSS - e.g CSS that indiscriminately applies to HTML elements, such as LI, UL - there occur visual problems. This has been the case with your page as well. It is fairly easy to workaround that by "cancelling" the global CSS propagation on the editor's parent element level. We will gladly look into your scenario and try to further improve on the editor's skins, if you send us a small working project with the CSS files you use in your project.

In your previous lovely version of controls, radEditor is an IFrame in runtime and therefore isolated from the host page's css and js. Very clean.
That is still the case. No difference in this respect - as long as the editor's content area is concerned. You can easily check the essentially identical implementation of RadEditor Classic and RadEditor for ASP.NET AJAX by using IE dev toolbar, FireBug or simply examining the source of the page.

(put a radEditor inside a div with its dir set to rtl and see it for yourself)
RadEditor Classic did provide a RTL skin that allows it to look good in RTL pages. Due to its completely different rendering, and the fact that now the RadEditor dialogs are built into the Telerik.Web.UI.dll, the new RadEditor for ASP.NET AJAX still does not have adequate support for RTL pages. This is one feature we are currently working on and it will appear in the coming Q3.

It's rally a bad idea to put something like editor inside a table! The IFrame version worked much better.
This statement suggests that  the "old" and the "new" editor are different in that manner. However, this is not correct. As mentioned above, they are the same.

I have a question too. The ScriptManager uses WebResource HttpHandlers to download the required js files to client's browser. Doesn't this prevent caching on client-side? (The same question goes to StyleSheetManager and css files' caching)
The answer is No. Browser caches files based on their URL and expiration. Using built-in script and css files work fine with browser caching.

Kind regards,
Tervel
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Achilles
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answered on 23 Sep 2008, 02:43 PM
Hello Tervel.
Thanks for your response and the time you share with users; this is what I've always loved about telerik :)

1. I just noticed the client-load-time and I have to admit it's much much better than the classic version.

2. How can I send the sample project to Telerik?

3. The smart tag and ActionList problem in UserControls applies to RadEditor too, but as you wrote, I'll ask them somewhere else. Would you please direct me to right place for asking them.

4. I will eagerly wait for the Q3 and RTL features

Best regards,
Mohammad Mahdi Saffari
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Tervel
Telerik team
answered on 26 Sep 2008, 07:40 AM
Hello Mohammad,

To send us a project (or any attachment) you should open a support ticket from your Client.net area.
Uploading files in the forums is disabled for a number of reasons (such as accidentally attaching fully runnable projects with developer version DLLs).

As for the smart tag and ActionList problem - we will research it, and see if we are able to reproduce it. It could be the case that the problem exists in VS2008 only. We will get back to you on that matter very soon.

Best wishes,
Tervel
the Telerik team

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