Mark Chipman
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Mark Chipman
asked on 13 Feb 2006, 11:30 PM
I thought that this title would get your attention.
I love the r.a.d. tool suite because the engineering that goes into these products is top-notch.
But what I'm going to make a push for here is to now take the tools to the next level by adding GUI sexiness to the mix. What I'm getting at here is that web world seems to be quickly becoming Web 2.0 centric with AJAX all the buzz and technologies like JSON and visual effects libraries like Dojo, Scriptaculous, moo.fx, and Walter Zorn's Drag and Drog library.
I think that now is time to add visual pizzazz to all of the tools including alpha channeled PNG graphics (as standard, even with IE), opacity, color shifting of objects, fading, animation (both linear and along paths such as parabolas, ellipse, sinoidal, etc.) and of course acceleration of objects in motion (acceleration and deceleration). In other words, could telerik make a standard "library" of features that all of its tools could call upon -- ala "prototype" or "behaviour" or "scriptaculous".
If this could be so, then I would propose that we send telerik links to examples of what we really really want in such a "library". This will help them visualize exactly what would need to be addressed in order to make our products visually act as we desire.
As I see it, there would be several sub-library modules that would drive the whole solution, but only be called in js if they were actually needed in order to perform a function -- ala Dojo. This would keep the .js files sizes down to a reasonable level.
Here a a possible starting point:
I love the r.a.d. tool suite because the engineering that goes into these products is top-notch.
But what I'm going to make a push for here is to now take the tools to the next level by adding GUI sexiness to the mix. What I'm getting at here is that web world seems to be quickly becoming Web 2.0 centric with AJAX all the buzz and technologies like JSON and visual effects libraries like Dojo, Scriptaculous, moo.fx, and Walter Zorn's Drag and Drog library.
I think that now is time to add visual pizzazz to all of the tools including alpha channeled PNG graphics (as standard, even with IE), opacity, color shifting of objects, fading, animation (both linear and along paths such as parabolas, ellipse, sinoidal, etc.) and of course acceleration of objects in motion (acceleration and deceleration). In other words, could telerik make a standard "library" of features that all of its tools could call upon -- ala "prototype" or "behaviour" or "scriptaculous".
If this could be so, then I would propose that we send telerik links to examples of what we really really want in such a "library". This will help them visualize exactly what would need to be addressed in order to make our products visually act as we desire.
As I see it, there would be several sub-library modules that would drive the whole solution, but only be called in js if they were actually needed in order to perform a function -- ala Dojo. This would keep the .js files sizes down to a reasonable level.
Here a a possible starting point:
- radBrowserCaps.js - browser sniffing
- radDOMHelper.js - akin to "prototype.js" helper functions
- radEventHandler.js - CSS integrated behaviors
- radSlider.js - slider functionality
- radGlidePath - object movement path calculation
- radAnimation.js - object movement and acceleration
- radOpacity.js - opacity shifting - ie fading
- radSizing.js - object sizing
- radObjectWrappers.js - wrappers for embedded object inclusion into webpages including: Flash, Media Player, JAVA Applets, Quicktime, Real Player, etc.
- radEffects.js - predesigned effects combining several transitions
- radAJAXJSON.js - AJAX and JSON functionality
- radWhatever.js - who knows what this will be, but I'm sure it will be something
This could all be the basis for new cool telerik solution-specific turnkey products like:
- r.a.d.Chat
- r.a.d.OutlookClone
- r.a.d.PictureBrowser - ala Flicker
- r.a.d.WidgetEngine
Anybody else want this stuff? I want my web apps to have content that glides-in, fades-out and fades-in, collapses smoothly, puffs-away, moves offscreen in a smooth arc in gradual acceleration, self-adjust in size, auto-scrolls, etc. Now is that too much to ask?? Well maybe, but I know that it really is quite doable now-a-days!
I have alot of samples that I would love to share in order to give telerik some inspiration of what's possible... but I'll save that for another thread.
Thanks for listening!
-Mark
10 Answers, 1 is accepted
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Marco Dissel
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answered on 14 Feb 2006, 01:32 PM
Nice idea, let me add another:
Don't you think that Atlas will be this base platform? On top of that Telerik and others will continue to build all kind of extensions..
I lik to know what Telerik will do with Atlas..
Thanks
Marco
- radKeyboard.js - support to attach function to keyboard shortcuts
Don't you think that Atlas will be this base platform? On top of that Telerik and others will continue to build all kind of extensions..
I lik to know what Telerik will do with Atlas..
Thanks
Marco
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px
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answered on 15 Feb 2006, 12:49 AM
I'd like to see telerik build solutions around Microsoft Standards where possible. If Atlas can be used or extended I think it should be.
Cheers, Pete
Cheers, Pete
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You know that "innovation" is our middle name:)
We are working on some very cool stuff that combines the best of AJAX and Atlas. You can be assured that whatever we do will offer support for Atlas so that you are not locked into anything super-special that does not conform to the Microsoft technology roadmap.
The exciting new capabilities of our products will be unveiled at www.ajaxseminar.com where we will be having a session. You will be able to watch the recording on sys-con.tv after the event:)
Nick
the telerik team
We are working on some very cool stuff that combines the best of AJAX and Atlas. You can be assured that whatever we do will offer support for Atlas so that you are not locked into anything super-special that does not conform to the Microsoft technology roadmap.
The exciting new capabilities of our products will be unveiled at www.ajaxseminar.com where we will be having a session. You will be able to watch the recording on sys-con.tv after the event:)
Nick
the telerik team
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Mark Chipman
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answered on 15 Feb 2006, 10:50 PM
Don't you think that Atlas will be this base platform?
Ahh Atlas... well possibly this could be a starting point for functionality. But honestly, Microsoft truely isn't on the "cutting edge" in web DHTML functionality. Don't get me wrong, cause I'm sure that Atlas will be a strong product... but I seriously doubt that Atlas will have nearly anywhere close to the kind of functionality that I'm talking about here... after all were talking about multi-vendor browser environments that must equally be addressed (not just IE centric/favored).
What I'm talking about telerik working on is very very advanced "sexy" functionality (after-all, that is the name of this thread).
On a side note - I think its rather interesting that someone hasn't come up with a dot.net equivalent to Ruby on Rails or Django (which both have the same kind of proposed features like I am proposing, ala embedded libraries such as Scriptaculous or Dojo). If anyone gets word of anything in the works as such, please post it.
Finally, in regards to the comment regarding avoiding straying from "Microsoft Standards", I'm not suggesting straying from their "standards" but rather promoting dramatically "improving upon" their basic functionality included with Atlas... this is just as it is where telerik's products improve up basic dot.net functionality.
-Regards,
Mark
Ahh Atlas... well possibly this could be a starting point for functionality. But honestly, Microsoft truely isn't on the "cutting edge" in web DHTML functionality. Don't get me wrong, cause I'm sure that Atlas will be a strong product... but I seriously doubt that Atlas will have nearly anywhere close to the kind of functionality that I'm talking about here... after all were talking about multi-vendor browser environments that must equally be addressed (not just IE centric/favored).
What I'm talking about telerik working on is very very advanced "sexy" functionality (after-all, that is the name of this thread).
On a side note - I think its rather interesting that someone hasn't come up with a dot.net equivalent to Ruby on Rails or Django (which both have the same kind of proposed features like I am proposing, ala embedded libraries such as Scriptaculous or Dojo). If anyone gets word of anything in the works as such, please post it.
Finally, in regards to the comment regarding avoiding straying from "Microsoft Standards", I'm not suggesting straying from their "standards" but rather promoting dramatically "improving upon" their basic functionality included with Atlas... this is just as it is where telerik's products improve up basic dot.net functionality.
-Regards,
Mark
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armand datema
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answered on 16 Feb 2006, 08:16 AM
I realy like this idea, I have cleints who want to have some of the telrik component features into there ow applications ( php cold fusion etc ) . I then have to try and take the telerik javascript file and generate some html tat will interface with them also to work in there other non asp.net site.
It would be great If we can have javascript libraries as well so that we are not glued to asp.net but can use it in other environments as well.
Just as im linking the yahoo uer interface libraries and patters it would be great to seel this coming from Telerik as well.
BTW : radGlidePath - object movement path calculation
been there done that, was a while ago if you are interested I can look it up
It would be great If we can have javascript libraries as well so that we are not glued to asp.net but can use it in other environments as well.
Just as im linking the yahoo uer interface libraries and patters it would be great to seel this coming from Telerik as well.
BTW : radGlidePath - object movement path calculation
been there done that, was a while ago if you are interested I can look it up
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Yuri Abele
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answered on 01 Mar 2006, 09:11 AM
To Mark Chipman:
Microsoft Atlas isn't "just IE centric/favored". Atlas hast special top abstraction level for compatibility with all popular browsers.
Microsoft Atlas isn't "just IE centric/favored". Atlas hast special top abstraction level for compatibility with all popular browsers.
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Mark Chipman
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answered on 03 Mar 2006, 08:23 AM
Hello Yuri:
I didn't ever claim that Microsoft wasn't going to support the big guns (IE, Firefox, Safari, Opera, Netscape or others) in Atlas... on the contrary, I'm sure they will... but semi-marginally at best.
I think you missed the point though that Microsoft often leans on their own products to provide "rich experiences" that utilize IE only characteristics (i.e. filters or behaviors)... they havn't yet made it a level playing field given equal attention to supporting the others guys... (for example, is the new IE going to support canvas?... I'm not banking on it. And how long has it taken Microsoft to get around to correctly defining alpha-channeling in PNG graphics?... In both these examples, Firefox and Opera already do and have for a while now)... and when they finally do, your really going to see some crazy/fantastic stuff.
So I was merely suggesting that telerik step up to the plate and take the user experience far past what I believe Microsoft is going to have with Altas... However, they should use Atlas as a core foundation, if you will, and then create more compelling "rich" experiences on that.
In closing, I'm not just whimsically saying for telerik to make something cool, and have it move, oscillate, rotate, fade in -fade out, slide in, etc.... and on you go. I know what I'm speaking of when I say that there are much more advanced user web GUI tools that can and should be built... and of course many of them I have already utilized, or have sample code of and have used to learn how to make nicer behaving and looking GUIs.
It really is possible to make sexy software on the web... innovators are usually the cutting edge and I know that telerik is no exception!
-Mark
I didn't ever claim that Microsoft wasn't going to support the big guns (IE, Firefox, Safari, Opera, Netscape or others) in Atlas... on the contrary, I'm sure they will... but semi-marginally at best.
I think you missed the point though that Microsoft often leans on their own products to provide "rich experiences" that utilize IE only characteristics (i.e. filters or behaviors)... they havn't yet made it a level playing field given equal attention to supporting the others guys... (for example, is the new IE going to support canvas?... I'm not banking on it. And how long has it taken Microsoft to get around to correctly defining alpha-channeling in PNG graphics?... In both these examples, Firefox and Opera already do and have for a while now)... and when they finally do, your really going to see some crazy/fantastic stuff.
So I was merely suggesting that telerik step up to the plate and take the user experience far past what I believe Microsoft is going to have with Altas... However, they should use Atlas as a core foundation, if you will, and then create more compelling "rich" experiences on that.
In closing, I'm not just whimsically saying for telerik to make something cool, and have it move, oscillate, rotate, fade in -fade out, slide in, etc.... and on you go. I know what I'm speaking of when I say that there are much more advanced user web GUI tools that can and should be built... and of course many of them I have already utilized, or have sample code of and have used to learn how to make nicer behaving and looking GUIs.
It really is possible to make sexy software on the web... innovators are usually the cutting edge and I know that telerik is no exception!
-Mark
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Nik Ivancic
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answered on 25 Mar 2006, 01:27 AM
I believe that Atlas is at least defined to be more than a UI library and that belief is confirmed in the presentation by Nikhil Kothari (Atlast Architect) who introduced Atlas as the vehicle to accelerate the current ASP platform to the Managed API in Indigo and Avalon.
So, the issue of Atlas compliance is more important than "standardization of User Interface". While I am completely in agreement with Mark Chipman, that there will always be a need for advanced players like Telerik, that Microsoft will not deliver what Telerik could do now, or a lot sooner than Microsoft, the point is that such advanced libraries should not be further constrained to be able to live in the Atlas context. A typical case in question is Atlas suppport for Web Services - so if I want to use Telerik for UI and Atlas for Web Services, I am in a bit of a hot water.
Nik Ivancic
CTO
Congral
So, the issue of Atlas compliance is more important than "standardization of User Interface". While I am completely in agreement with Mark Chipman, that there will always be a need for advanced players like Telerik, that Microsoft will not deliver what Telerik could do now, or a lot sooner than Microsoft, the point is that such advanced libraries should not be further constrained to be able to live in the Atlas context. A typical case in question is Atlas suppport for Web Services - so if I want to use Telerik for UI and Atlas for Web Services, I am in a bit of a hot water.
Nik Ivancic
CTO
Congral
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shashidhar ch
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answered on 12 Mar 2010, 11:40 AM
it is not that much good.
it will not support all browser competibility.
no quick reply from the site . we are thinking to buy or not
how to to export outlook calender events to radscheduler.
please give me reply .
it will not support all browser competibility.
no quick reply from the site . we are thinking to buy or not
how to to export outlook calender events to radscheduler.
please give me reply .
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Hello shashidhar ch,
We will be happy to help you with your question. Since we offer 4 different versions of RadScheduler (ASP.NET, WinForms, WPF, Silverlight), and we are not sure which version you are using, I will request that you ask your question in the respective forum. If you would like to get a faster response time, please open a support ticket.
Thank you for your cooperation and understanding.
All the best,
Vassil
the Telerik team
Do you want to have your say when we set our development plans? Do you want to know when a feature you care about is added or when a bug fixed? Explore the Telerik Public Issue Tracking system and vote to affect the priority of the items.
We will be happy to help you with your question. Since we offer 4 different versions of RadScheduler (ASP.NET, WinForms, WPF, Silverlight), and we are not sure which version you are using, I will request that you ask your question in the respective forum. If you would like to get a faster response time, please open a support ticket.
Thank you for your cooperation and understanding.
All the best,
Vassil
the Telerik team
Do you want to have your say when we set our development plans? Do you want to know when a feature you care about is added or when a bug fixed? Explore the Telerik Public Issue Tracking system and vote to affect the priority of the items.