Visual Designer in VS2015

53 posts, 0 answers
  1. Mathieu
    Mathieu avatar
    21 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2014

    Posted 30 Mar 2016 Link to this post

    For people who can no longer wait for Telerik to release their codegen tool, an alternative has been released (albeit beta for now) by the DevArt team. It is obviously not free, but it is there...

    http://blog.devart.com/entity-developer-6-0-new-orm-designer-for-telerik-data-access.html

    I've downloaded a trial, and it seems to deliver as promised.

    Disclaimer: I am not affiliated with DevArt in any way ! I just happen to be subscribed to their newsletter, and was notified of the support of Telerik Data Access in their latest version.

  2. DuelingCats
    DuelingCats avatar
    53 posts
    Member since:
    Jul 2012

    Posted 03 May 2016 Link to this post

    I wonder if Open Access is going to become abandonware.
  3. Marko Gluhak
    Marko Gluhak avatar
    69 posts
    Member since:
    Apr 2006

    Posted 03 May 2016 Link to this post

    I'm not sure about this :(, but after I think 10 years I did not renew my subscription with Telerik, and main reason is OpenAccess.
    I move forward with EF for ORM. I have also start to evaluate Syncfusion as it comes totaly free In Enterprise version for me as one developer.
    What I must admit is that I really  enyoj those 10 years with superb support but last 4-5 months with this OA decision its something I dont like (I'm mostly dissappint in not giving honest answer about OA).

    So for now, bye to Telerik.
  4. Bernd
    Bernd avatar
    79 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2013

    Posted 03 May 2016 in reply to DuelingCats Link to this post

    Let's think about it:

    Progress bought Telerik. The only overlapping item in the product portfolio is DataAccess. Telerik is not making money with it. Therefore it is no big sacrifice to kick it.

    But Progress/Telerik isn't offering any alternative. No. They even stop supporting it in the MVC scaffolding. See Kenshin's answer here: http://kendoui-feedback.telerik.com/forums/127393-telerik-kendo-ui-feedback/suggestions/12251277-use-telerik-data-access-context-in-mvc-scaffolding

    DataAccess is dead. I'll stick to my code generator and then switch to EF7 as soon as it's stable. EF6 is IMHO too restrictive in the supported DBs.

  5. Oscar
    Oscar avatar
    4 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2011

    Posted 12 May 2016 Link to this post

    When you have plan to publish this tool?
    When you have plan to publish this tool
    When you have plan to publish this tool
    When you have plan to publish this tool
    When you have plan to publish this tool
  6. DGraham
    DGraham avatar
    31 posts
    Member since:
    Sep 2008

    Posted 25 May 2016 Link to this post

    Any news on this? Is DataAccess something that is still being developed or has development of this been abandoned? Can you let us know so that I can decide if I should carry on developing with this tool or just push on with EF instead.
  7. Doroteya
    Admin
    Doroteya avatar
    500 posts

    Posted 30 May 2016 Link to this post

    Hello,

    I am pleased to inform you that the implementation of the tool for generating new fluent models based on existing databases is ready. There's an unofficial pre-release Beta version at https://www.nuget.org/packages/Telerik.DataAccess.Fluent.CodeGeneration. You can download it and give it a try to see what we have been cooking for so long. At the time present, we are waiting to clear some formal obstacles before we can release the source code and the official first Beta version of the tool.

    A bit of details:

    What you can do
    - create new fluent models based on existing database schemata. 
    - switch between SQL type mapping (same as Add New Fluent Model wizard was using) and Backend-Independent type mapping

    What is missing
    - update existing Fluent Model support
    - generation for Stored Procedures
    - Visual Basic support

    Known issues
    - Only DBO (default) schema is read and mapped

    Next steps for the tool are
    1. Publish the source code in GitHub
    2. Gather your feedback in the repository
    3. Implement Update Existing Fluent Model functionality

    Thank you for your patience.

    Regards,
    Doroteya
    Telerik
     
    Check out the latest announcement about Telerik Data Access vNext as a powerful framework able to solve core development problems.
  8. Anurag
    Anurag avatar
    2 posts
    Member since:
    Jul 2008

    Posted 14 Jul 2016 in reply to Doroteya Link to this post

    Any update on this front?
  9. Doroteya
    Admin
    Doroteya avatar
    500 posts

    Posted 18 Jul 2016 Link to this post

    Hi Anurag,

    The state of the code generation tool remains unchanged. The release of the official Beta version is in progress and there are formal procedures that have to be executed. At this point though, I am unable to provide you with a concrete timeframe about the release date.

    Thank you for your interest.

    Regards,
    Doroteya
    Telerik by Progress
     
    Check out the latest announcement about Telerik Data Access vNext as a powerful framework able to solve core development problems.
  10. Steve
    Steve avatar
    2 posts
    Member since:
    Jan 2014

    Posted 18 Jul 2016 in reply to Doroteya Link to this post

    Hi,

    I do hope you realise the damage that this issue has caused to Telerik's reputation. We have actively moved away from using your Data Access in favour of EF. It has also caused us to think twice about using your products elsewhere. We have been loyal DevCraft subscribers for some time but the way that you have handled this situation is very poor. There were many good reasons to move to VS2015 and to find that we had been abandoned by Telerik Data Access was disappointing to say the least. I know that you will claim that MS have also dropped their data designer in the latest incarnation of EF but very importantly, they still support EF6 within VS2015 with its data designer.

    I feel that this was a major miscalculation on your part and the continual delays to a workaround are only confounding the problem.

    Steve

  11. Marko Gluhak
    Marko Gluhak avatar
    69 posts
    Member since:
    Apr 2006

    Posted 18 Jul 2016 Link to this post

    Hi,

    just to confirm what Steve already said. I have been loyal subscriber with Telerik for 10 years. Because of this, I abondened Telerik and now I use EF for ORM and as I'm internet programmer I swith for now on Syncfusion as they have free version (Communuty License) fro individual developers and small business.

  12. Marko Gluhak
    Marko Gluhak avatar
    69 posts
    Member since:
    Apr 2006

    Posted 18 Jul 2016 Link to this post

    Hi,

    I agree with Steve and I'm one of those developers that were loyal to Telerik for 10 years. After this with Data Access I'm no longer subscriber to any developer tools. I turn to EF for ORM and as for programming part for now I'm using Syncfusion (their Community licence version).

  13. Jörg
    Jörg  avatar
    8 posts
    Member since:
    Mar 2009

    Posted 04 Aug 2016 Link to this post

    Well I'm now in the same situation as many others. Have to think about to move away for a different ORM that supports at least code generation from an existing database.

    I'm really not getting it with this Code First Generation thing in the ORM industry. I mean it's kind of nice for a some playground projects, but if you have a project with 200 or more tables, you probably use a designer tool to manage your database. These tools allow you to create the tables, the indexes on the columns you want, it lets you document the database, lets you create view and many things more. And it provides a graphic designer to do it and create the relations and everything.
    Nobody can tell me, that anyone is capable of keeping the overview of 200 code files with DTO code.

    Well I don't kneed the visual designer of OpenAccess inside Visual Studio, but I need to be able to update the model from my database, and not delivering tools for that is simply just embarrassingly from Telerik.
    It is simply really poor what Telerik did here. A big change like that should be announced a year or more in advance with notification in the Warnings as deprecated.
    Not doing this shows me that Progress seems to be money centered, whereas I always thought of Telerik being developer centered. And realizing this is not a good thing...

  14. Eugeniy
    Eugeniy avatar
    63 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2011

    Posted 12 Aug 2016 Link to this post

    I awesome love DataAccess (btw try to do this in EF: table1.Where(row=>row.Table2.Any(row2=>row2.CreationDate.Time<=new TimeSpan(12,30,0)))  :D)

    But, I can't explain my team why we need to create database from scratch(  At least, please, make a DB2Code generation tool for start

  15. Anurag
    Anurag avatar
    2 posts
    Member since:
    Jul 2008

    Posted 06 Dec 2016 Link to this post

    Isn't it possible to make an open source community for OpenAccess Designer tool? I hope everyone here will be more than happy to contribute.
  16. Dave
    Dave avatar
    7 posts
    Member since:
    May 2013

    Posted 17 Dec 2016 Link to this post

    DevArt is not comparable in any way - Telerik, Data Access is the only reason I stuck with your company and the Visual Designer saved me hundreds of hours.  Please make the change to allow the designer to work or release the code for the community to maintain it.

    I am holding an old image of a machine for only this reason - as the designer is the preferred method of rapid modeling.

  17. Ralf
    Ralf avatar
    10 posts
    Member since:
    May 2012

    Posted 25 Apr in reply to Dave Link to this post

    Yes, please provide a Designer for actual visual Studio Versions!
  18. Jeff
    Jeff avatar
    2 posts
    Member since:
    Mar 2013

    Posted 26 Apr in reply to Ralf Link to this post

    You might want to read this...

    http://www.telerik.com/data-access-sunsetting

     

  19. Eugeniy
    Eugeniy avatar
    63 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2011

    Posted 26 Apr in reply to Jeff Link to this post

    i'm crying.

    At least it can be moved to open-source, no?

  20. Peter Huisman
    Peter Huisman avatar
    17 posts
    Member since:
    Dec 2004

    Posted 26 Apr Link to this post

    Well that did it. :(

    How can I trust them saying they will keep supporting other components. Trust is gone and so am I. No more Telerik for me. 

  21. Dave
    Dave avatar
    7 posts
    Member since:
    May 2013

    Posted 26 Apr in reply to Eugeniy Link to this post

    I could not agree more. Open source both the data access library and the designer. There is no reason not too at this point.  
  22. Jeff
    Jeff avatar
    2 posts
    Member since:
    Mar 2013

    Posted 26 Apr in reply to Eugeniy Link to this post

    Yes, I am stunned over this. You would think such an integral piece would be shifted to github and allow the community to have an option instead of just killing it. I have used OpenAccess/DataAccess for many years and it is an integral core to our applications that is not so quickly or easily replaced. The absence of the visual designer was indeed a blow, but thanks to some clever T4 templating, not intolerable, but killing the product completely (even though they were already giving it away), just wow is all I can say.

    So if anyone is listening, github.com/telerik/dataaccess please!! Allow the community to decide. (And no, continuing to use existing packages with no further updates is not really an option, and if we wanted to use Entity Framework, we already would have...)

  23. Ralf
    Ralf avatar
    10 posts
    Member since:
    May 2012

    Posted 26 Apr in reply to Peter Huisman Link to this post

    i agree, if you have some Projects which using Data Access and on every Project 5 to 80 Tables then you can not easyly Change to another Technology. It is not like a small demo Programm.

    I am also very disapointed with telerik. You Play a lot for telerik, and the Money is also for the safety to set on the right "horse", but this "telerik horse died"!

    @Telerik: Please think about this; for our next Project we will think more about the question "Did telerik realy save time for us?"

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