End-User Designer

53 posts, 0 answers
  1. MarkMasson
    MarkMasson avatar
    4 posts
    Member since:
    Dec 2006

    Posted 11 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    Hi Vassil, Take a look at DevExpress XtraReports product. It has a customizable Winforms end user designer. Report definitions may be saved in an XML flat file format and may be presented in a Winforms client or a browser. Having integrated it in to our app I'll say the API is not as intuitive as what we find in Teleriks components. But the end user capabilities are comprehensive. Like others here, we use Teleriks components in our application with great results. But unfortunately the reporting tool set is of no value to us (Lucid) without an End User Designer. Sure wish Telerik would create one that is very customizable and comprehensive.

    Mark Masson
    Director of Technology
    Lucid Data Corporation
  2. Alexandre Jobin
    Alexandre Jobin avatar
    125 posts
    Member since:
    Jan 2010

    Posted 11 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    I just want to add my thought on this one. I've read this week that Siverlight 5 will probably be the last version of the series. Microsoft will not put more effort into this product. Maybe i'm wrong but before you put to much effort into Silverlight, just be sure that there's a real future for that.

    My opinion would be to not go with the Silverlight approach. Maybe with html5, you will be able to do something great!
  3. TonyG
    TonyG avatar
    239 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2006

    Posted 12 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    For anyone wondering about Silverlight 5 and beyond, at this moment the topic is still uncomfortably in the air:
    http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/will-there-be-a-silverlight-6-and-does-it-matter/11180
  4. Clay
    Clay avatar
    2 posts
    Member since:
    Oct 2011

    Posted 14 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    Need a simple way for non-power users to include/exclude columns from a finished report with a fixed data source.  The published report may have 20 columns in the query, only show 10 and allow the user to remove/add from the availble columns.  We need a web based UI.
  5. Clay
    Clay avatar
    2 posts
    Member since:
    Oct 2011

    Posted 14 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    Need a simple way for non-power users to include/exclude columns from a finished report with a fixed data source.  The published report may have 20 columns in the query, only show 10 and allow the user to remove/add from the availble columns.  We need a web based UI.
  6. Stuart Hemming
    Stuart Hemming avatar
    1622 posts
    Member since:
    Jul 2004

    Posted 14 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    Clay,

    I reckon you could do that really easily yourself.

    If the datasource is fixed, simply create a form listing the available columns as a number of checkboxes. Get the list of checked items and pass it to the report as, say, a string.

    Match the string values to the name of columns in the datasource and mark the relevant textboxes visible as appropriate.

    I've never done this, so you might find you have to move the visible columns left to fill gaps, but the logic for that would be straightforward.

    -- 
    Stuart
  7. TonyG
    TonyG avatar
    239 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2006

    Posted 14 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    I'm starting to wonder if this should be an open source project hosted at CodePlex.com.  It would help if Telerik could provide the benefit of the experience they gathered in creating the VS addin.  The information could be employed in the creation of whatever UI's people want.  Of course Telerik controls would be used to create the new utility.

    (Typing quickly and I know this sounds dis-jointed...)   Off the top of my head I'm thinking there needs to be more than one UI which integrates with a generic middle-tier for rules.  With this "MVC" pattern people can add UI's based on Silverlight, MVC webforms, or maybe even winforms or WP7.  The UI just renders the visual look and feel of reports.  The middle-tier pulls fields and other metadata from configurable datasources, again operating through a generic provider model rather than hard-coding to ADO.NET, entities, etc.  I might prefer an existing BAL assembly for my data source, where someone else might want to use canned AdventureWorks resources, or something like LINQtoTwitter.  A reporting application like this should be independent of the data source, but all data sources need to be able to provide what's required for the UI to define reports, through classes implementing this provider definition,.

    I can picture this, just don't have any free time of my own to actually create the framework.  It would be real nice if Telerik could pioneer this.  If the project is based on RadControls, anyone using the code is going to need a license.  Just don't host executables, or work out some other way to protect rights.

    BTW, for anyone who gets an error after they post to this thread, just go back to the thread page from the error and refresh. Your post should be there despite the error.
  8. Maurice
    Maurice avatar
    1 posts
    Member since:
    Sep 2011

    Posted 18 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    The news that will be a end-user designer at the beginning of 2012 is very good news!! We also need this functionality in a solution we are working on at the moment. If the designer will be there at the beginning of next year, we can now start with building a framework and system reports.
  9. Kelly
    Kelly avatar
    1 posts
    Member since:
    Nov 2011

    Posted 22 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    We also have evaluated the Telerik Reporting and also need the End User Report Designer capability. Please put this feature at the top of your road map. The lack of this feature is the only thing keeping us from going with Telerik Reporting. I went back and read all the previous posts and saw that Telerik is planning to implement an End User Report designer in the beginning of 2012. I hope this is true. We wanted to get our vote for how this should work for our needs. The application we are developing is a WPF based client application. We need for the End User Report Designer to run from within our application. 
  10. TonyG
    TonyG avatar
    239 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2006

    Posted 22 Nov 2011 Link to this post

    "The lack of this feature is the only thing keeping us from going with Telerik Reporting."

    Let's all remember that Telerik Reporting is a fine tool for what it does, but many of us are looking for something else instead of or in addition to what Reporting does. Yeah, I also have a client that asks "why did we buy Telerik Reporting when we still need a developer to create all of our reports?"

    Telerik Reporting is for developers. Maybe Telerik Marketing didn't think far enough ahead to the idea that the only reason why developers need to create reports is that end-users don't have the ability. But there are applications where the requirements are so complex that we cannot ask end-users to satisfy their needs with an adhoc query tool. I wouldn't want an adhoc query utility to be as complex as Telerik Reporting, just with a user-friend front-end. That said, if that were available I'd be happy to have a new vehicle for revenue in helping our clients to create reports using the complex tool. There needs to be a balance between a tool that's adequate enough for most operational needs and one that's too sophisticated for average users. That's where a consumer-facing front-end needs to be differentiated from Telerik Reporting as we know it now.

    We need to know when to pull specific tools from our kit. This tool shouldn't be removed from the kit, or dismissed as unusable, just used differently as soon as we can add alternatives to the kit.
  11. tdemeza
    tdemeza avatar
    8 posts
    Member since:
    Apr 2007

    Posted 16 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    Just wanted to hit up Telerik for an update on this.  Please let us know if this tool will ever come to fruition. 

    It's decision time. We can't wait any longer.

    Thanks!
  12. Eddie Conner
    Eddie Conner avatar
    32 posts
    Member since:
    Dec 2009

    Posted 16 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    I believe Telerik now has an end user report designer in their latest build

    http://www.telerik.com/products/reporting/creating-reports.aspx#end-user-report-designer
  13. Vassil Petev
    Admin
    Vassil Petev avatar
    1765 posts

    Posted 18 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    Indeed, we released the first beta of the stand-alone Telerik Report Designer a few months ago. You can find more information here: http://www.telerik.com/products/reporting/report-designer.aspx

    Feel free to download Telerik Reporting Q1 2012 and give it a spin. Your feedback will be appreciated - it help us tailor-made the Designer according to your needs!


    Cheers,
    Vassil Petev
    the Telerik team

    Q3’11 of Telerik Reporting is available for download. Register for the What's New in Data Tools webinar to see what's new and get a chance to WIN A FREE LICENSE!

  14. TonyG
    TonyG avatar
    239 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2006

    Posted 20 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    I already commented in the product forum a while back but I'll add a note here. The new reporting product seems great for most needs, and that of course should be Telerik's primary goal. What's missing is a MVC architecture where we can create our own data provider. In the modern world there are more sources of data than relational databases - we obviously use different .DataSource entities for grids and other controls. I'm hoping to see a provider model added which will allow use to link in a custom DAL which implements a Telerik-defined API. This way end-users will be able to report on any data source available. Until that happens I can't sell it without creating a near-line RDBMS depository for users to query. There are a lot of products already out there where we could have done this.

    Speaking of selling and MVC, on the front-end it would be nice if VAR/developers could co-brand the UI so that it integrates with existing applications. Right now it's a completely separate "bolt-on".

    So no, it doesn't suit my needs or industry of applications yet, but it's a good start.

    Thanks to Telerik for being responsive!
  15. Stefen
    Stefen avatar
    18 posts
    Member since:
    Oct 2010

    Posted 20 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    @TonyG How does the ObjectDataSource not allow you to blindly bind to any data you want regardless of data store? If you can push objects of any type into a control then your data layer implementation becomes irrelevant. 

    http://telerik.com/help/reporting/object-data-source-how-to-bind-to-business-object.html 
  16. TonyG
    TonyG avatar
    239 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2006

    Posted 20 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    You're referring to the RadControls/Reporting component for developers.
    For the End-User Reporting utility, see the product page:
    http://www.telerik.com/products/reporting/report-designer.aspx

    "Since this is a client application, there is no programmatic control over the reports. This also means that no events and no Object/OpenAccess/Entity Data Source will be supported."

  17. Stefen
    Stefen avatar
    18 posts
    Member since:
    Oct 2010

    Posted 20 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    So you want your users to create the report , then configure the data for that report. What is it that you will do besides own a license to telerik reporting engine ?

    Letting users lay out a report template is one thing, but letting them decide how and what data gets put into those templates is irresponsible as a developer. Your giving them too much rope to hang themselves with. 
  18. TonyG
    TonyG avatar
    239 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2006

    Posted 20 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    Here's a scenario. The report designer should allows us to link a DLL which exposes BAL that conforms to a defined API. The API might include methods like GetFields (returning names, types, constraints, etc) and GetData(params). The result set might be a standard DataSet or DataTable where columns agree with the Fields. The Fields (and related data types, etc) are used by end-users to design their reports. So they select a provider and design their report. They then run the report against the same provider.

    Note that with this scenario the end-user is completely unaware of the data source. All they should really see are field names. The source might be a web service against SalesForce, a local application or CRM, SAP, Twitter, or an aggregation of multiple sources similar to that provided through SSRS. Note also that this is exactly what we do with Telerik Reporting right now using ObjectDatasources, Entities, etc. So why should our reporting capabilities now be limited as a trade off for giving end-users the power of report design?

    From the report designer product page: "Displays data from any SQL database (inc. MS SQL Server, Oracle, etc.) and Microsoft Analysis Services Cubes".

    OK, we can put the DAL behind a supported database, do the ETL, and let the report designer hit this replicated data source, but we shouldn't need to do that.

    The bottom line here is that the data source is irrelevant - all modern development abstracts the UI from the model so why should this be any different? The hardcoded binding to relational data structures artificially and unnecessarily restricts the product to a limited audience.

    Any help?
  19. Steve
    Admin
    Steve avatar
    10941 posts

    Posted 21 Apr 2012 Link to this post

    Hello Tony,

    As usual we highly appreciate your feedback and any constructive criticism. The Report Designer is still in Beta, so what you see right now is not the final product. I believe that our replies in the comments of the Telerik Report Designer blog post answer your questions, namely:
    • We plan to extend the datasources support and include a datasource component capable to access custom data layers that expose their data via data service.
    • At this time, we do not have plans to offer a Report Designer Component which can be used from within applications. The Report Designer will be a stand-alone application in the first few versions.
    • The Report Designer will not be brandable.

    Regards,
    Steve
    the Telerik team

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  20. Rich
    Rich avatar
    20 posts
    Member since:
    Feb 2004

    Posted 22 Dec 2012 Link to this post

    So all this talk in the thread about a designer that would work with either HTML5 or Silverlight and Telerik releases a stand-a-lone .EXE which is useless for a SaaS product that is web based. I really think Telerik bailed on this and took the easy way out instead of providing a real ad-hoc tool that would bolster their product.

    I haven't heard of any plans to release a version of their end user reports that would be useful for web based product offerings, other than previous posts here that have apparently been abandoned. I would like to know IF there is a product release that will come within this year that will provide that functionality or should I take my renewal money for Telerik and buy another product that already offers this?
  21. Svetoslav
    Admin
    Svetoslav avatar
    649 posts

    Posted 02 Jan 2013 Link to this post

    Hi Richard,

    Yes, for 2013 we plan some major improvements on the way we build and present reports in the Web and the all as HTML5 will be the main focus. As of now I cannot give you any details what and when will be available but as soon as we have any valid time frame we will make it public in the product road map.

    Anyway we will highly appreciate if can share with us your plans and your expectations (you can always open a separate support ticket if you need to send us any sensible information).

    Regards,
    Svetoslav
    the Telerik team

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  22. Jörg
    Jörg avatar
    1 posts
    Member since:
    Jul 2013

    Posted 31 Jul 2013 Link to this post

    Is the source code for the Report Designer also available for licensed devs? Is it allowed to customize it and hand it over to our users?
  23. Elian
    Admin
    Elian avatar
    435 posts

    Posted 02 Aug 2013 Link to this post

    Hi,

    The Telerik Report Designer is a free tool that we ship along with the product and we do not provide any sources for it. 
     

    Regards,
    Elian
    Telerik

    Have you tried the new visualization options in Telerik Reporting Q2 2013? You can get them from your account.

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